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Thread: SEB-standard: Week 8 - Expectations, Aspirations, & Collaborations!

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    SEB-standard: Week 8 - Expectations, Aspirations, & Collaborations!

    Wednesday means two things. 1 – New comics. Well, not this week, but usually! and 2 – I have to get up a new column installment.

    So, this week I decided to feed off the momentum of Forby’s Bolts & Nuts, because 1 – It’s such a great column and 2 – it’s easier than coming up with my own idea.

    Now, this week Forby didn’t just rain on our parade, he tsunamied the whole island on which our parade was being held. Was he wrong to do so? Hells no. We all knew that tsunami was out there, he just showed us the true devastation it can unleash. Now I’m gonna take a look at the sunnier side, just because it amuses me to play the “optimist” role. It’s new for me.

    Anyway, Forby brought up the folly of collaborations, which is usually fairly accurate. However, he kinda played up the negative aspects and ignored the pros to collabos done right. I realize he was making a specific point, and that point was the error of all those people who think they can get a Jim Lee level artist for free and all that. But there IS a time and a place for collaborations. DIGITAL WEBBING wouldn’t have left a specific spot for those ads if they didn’t have some merit. Also, DW wouldn’t have so many Do NOT blast the collaboration ads for offering no pay stickies if they were all evil.

    So, Seb, if you agree with Forby (which I do) that collaborations for no pay are an unrealistic over-reaching pipe-dream, what could possibly be there “time & place”?

    Well, kiddies, I’m glad you asked!

    First, if you are truly doing this for the love of the medium, and not to break into Hollywood (shyah, good luck with that), then the idea of creating your book and getting your work out there will outweigh the unrealistic dreams of getting rich. You’ll realize the blood, sweat, and tears that will go into this, and will do so with the love of the work in your heart. If, by some miracle, you meet someone of an equal mindset, who is willing to work with you – note I say WITH you, and not FOR you, I’m talking equal partners in a TRUE collaboration – then, even better, as you can each play to each other’s strengths.

    For example, my friend Neil, whom I’ve known for a few years now, but didn’t get to REALLY know until we both participated in (separate) 24 HOUR COMIC BOOKS at our LCS, is collaborating with me on one of my creations. We had talked ideas, myself being more of a writer, and Neil being more of an artist, and he became very VERY excited over one of my heroes. We talked a bit, and Neil did a rough sketch….and totally blew me away. Since then, his energy has relaunched not one but three rewrites of my original script, and his interpretation has become the definitive look for my character, now OUR character, as Neil now owns 50% of the creation.

    I am aware of the time and effort that goes into drawing a comic page. I am also aware of the time and effort that goes into writing one. I’m not here to take advantage of an artist and get someone to draw my every whim and fancy. I’m here to create a comic and have someone create it with me. If a writer can be expected to be serious enough about his craft to write and create stories on the hope of possible publication and MAYBE some back end pay, then so can the artists. In the end, it will benefit both, as they both get much needed practice and experience at creating a book. In the end, they both have finished product for their portfolios. They both got something accomplished which can be a tool for making that next step.

    So, while everything Forby said is 100% true, and should be considered before entering into any agreements with people (or before advertising for people to make agreements with), I wanted to make it clear that not all collaborations are evil, one-sided, flights of fancy.

    It’s like Forby says, it’s all about expectations. If you go into this expecting everyone to do as you say, and that your book will be the next “big thing” prepare for disappointment. But if you go into this expecting to do something you love, and work with similarly inspired folks, and earn your lumps, then you can expect some degree of success. That success could just be in holding something in your hand and saying “I made this” or it could be making enough money for a future issue. But, it could also be, doing a good enough job to catch the right somebody’s eye….

    My collaborative partner, Neil, said to me the other day “…even if this doesn't go beyond us, I just want you to know I'm having the best time... and enjoying drawing for the first time in a long time.” So, that’s my success right there. How great is that to have an artist say to you?

    Anyway…I guess my point is don’t let your EXPECTATIONS get too high, but never EVER let your ASPIRATIONS fall too low!
    Last edited by SebastianPiccione; Thursday, December 04, 2008 at 02:23 AM.
    "Living Robert Venditti's Plan B!"

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  2. StevenForbes Guest

    Well said, Seb. Well said.

    Tsunami? Me? Really? I had no idea... (well, maybe a small one.)



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    You are a force of nature, my friend.

    I'm glad you liked this installment of S-s. You did inspire it, after all!
    Only in the comic world, can columns have a crossover.

    Crisis on Infinite Posts! Secret Inspiration. WAR OF THE INDEPENDENT Thinkers!
    "Living Robert Venditti's Plan B!"

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  4. StevenForbes Guest

    Force of nature, huh? Riiiight. One thing I've learned from watching lots of bad tv, never start to belive your own hype.

    I'd be satisfied with being the catalyst for a few writers raising their game. As long as I can do that and continue to be relevant, I'll keep doing it.



  5. Join Date
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    Well, you've certainly proven you can be both a catalyst and relevant.
    You've gotten quite the following here, and even more so on DW.
    Many the novice, and semi-pro writer already defer to your wisdom.

    And, I gotta tell ya, the fact that you are a humble and self-effacing Editor DOES make your brutal honesty easier to bear.
    "Living Robert Venditti's Plan B!"

    CAT. 5



  6. StevenForbes Guest

    I only efface myself in private, thank you very much!

    Huh? You didn't mean it that way?

    Well now, don't I feel sheepish...

    But seriously, it's not my intent to be brutal, it's my intent to tell the truth as I see it. It's also part of my mission to equip writers with what they need to make an honest run for the game.

    But this isn't about me. This is about your piece. You are living proof that, not only do collaborations work, but also that I have no clue about that which I speak. Good job, because someone needs to cut that Forby jerk down to size!



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    Uhm...you're effacing yourself in public again!

    I'm living proof? yeah, I think SEBASTIAN is from the Latin, meaning "exception that proves the rule".

    ...actually, Sebastian is from the Greek, meaning "respected or revered".
    That, kids, is what we call IRONY!
    "Living Robert Venditti's Plan B!"

    CAT. 5



  8. spyhawk824 Guest

    Couldn't have said it better myself SEB you are the man... He's a great writer folks... and in case it wasn't clear...I'm having the best time working with him and if nothing else its made drawing fun again. Thanks again Sebastian.
    Neil



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    There you have it folks, straight from the 'Hawk's mouth!

    You always hear writer's in interviews saying how great it is to work with so-and-so because they bring such energy and enthusiasm to the project?

    Neil is that so-and-so! Talk about your truest sense of the word collaboration. It's like a cycle. He gets excited about the story and does some kick-ass sketches. I get excited about the sketches, and bring up the level of my writing. he gets excited by the new writing, and ups the ante on his artwork, which, in turn, gets me to improve....

    ...everybody see where I'm goin' with this?
    Last edited by SebastianPiccione; Saturday, December 06, 2008 at 02:28 PM.
    "Living Robert Venditti's Plan B!"

    CAT. 5



  10. spyhawk824 Guest

    Just think of the possibilities if we were doing this full time LOL... ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh to dream... All I'm gonna say I read the first 7 pages before the rewrite , and I'm blown away...I can't wait to see the rewrite....If it's better... (which I can't even imagine) It's going to take a crowbar to peel me away from this project... Also what usually happens to me is I'll be into a character, then see a movie or read another comic and my attention switches to those characters... in this case 3 comic Movies and some comics later Seb's character is still getting me juiced ... So when you find a collaboration that works and pushes you to improve and gets you excited... stick with it... Keep the dream alive as long as your grounded in reality and above all... don't draw to get hired, don't write or draw for someone else..write or draw for the enjoyment and fun of doing it ... and this project whoooooooohooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo is what i'm saying.



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