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Thread: Week 51- Horror Overview

  1. MartinBrandt Guest

    Quote Originally Posted by Dungbeetle View Post
    I'd be wary of criticising sultry posh vampires... I mean, it's all good bringing that type of monster down to earth, but the whole point of them, in my mind, is as a metaphor for bloodsucking aristocracy. Hence the men are effeminate and they all wear nice clothes. Well, that's the genre convention. It's been messed with and "brought down to earth" countless times, but there's a reason why it's there in the first place. If you go with traditionally accepted vampire lore them one has to be "sired", which deepens the vampire snobbery. Hmm. Living in the hills, coming down at night to feed off the peasantry? That sound like anybody's landlord perchance?
    I think perhaps you need to check your lore. The one you have there is closer to a Bram Stoker or perhaps even John Polidori. This is your aristocratic style vampire. The true lore lies much deeper.

    Some vampire and even werewolf lore hold some place in the realm of disease and plague.

    The Humanized version came much later in the lore, it came in the form of fiction. It was not from tales passed down by scared villagers but from authors seeking to sell books.



  2. StevenForbes Guest

    I have to find my copy of Dracula and read it again for a story I want to write. I have a great story idea (ideas, really), and just now got in contact with an artist to help me bring part one to life.

    It's just too bad I'll be sitting on the art for a couple of months if he agrees to do it. However, it'll all be for the best. I'll be publishing it on the web, and moving it to print from there. I just need to find time to write the other installments! If I don't come up for air for a while, you'll know where to find me.



  3. Dungbeetle Guest

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinBrandt View Post
    I think perhaps you need to check your lore. The one you have there is closer to a Bram Stoker or perhaps even John Polidori. This is your aristocratic style vampire. The true lore lies much deeper.

    Some vampire and even werewolf lore hold some place in the realm of disease and plague.

    The Humanized version came much later in the lore, it came in the form of fiction. It was not from tales passed down by scared villagers but from authors seeking to sell books.
    Aaaaargh. By "Lore" I meant "Canon".

    The most historically correct version doesn't automatically become the most entertaining, or meaningful, for that matter. Like I said, horror is at its best when it's allegorical. Frankenstein is horror but it's also often viewed as the original science fiction story because it deals with the subject of man playing God. A vampire that is not aristocratic may be more in keeping with folklore, but does it make a good story, or does it just turn the vampire back into a generic monster that could for all intents and purposes be replaced with a goblin, big scary dog or mother in law? The idea of vampires needing to be sired just builds upon this.

    You can take that or leave it. I just think the idea of vampires as metaphor for social parasites preying on the vulnerable can still be flipped a million different original ways if people want to. You obviously don't share my opinion of landlords.

    Gerb - I can remember Alan Moore's Swamp Thing making my skin crawl. I think it was a combination of the acidic colours (note, sometimes crazy phantasmogasm colour schemes are actually more horrific than black, black, blaaaack) and Moore's often OTT purple prose. But I think having to read all the captions gives back an element of the novel to the comic, leaving room to explain the inner world, while letting the images just be suggestive. I think that's why Hellblazer works for me to, because it's mostly first person captioned. It's not a typical horror thing. You're not scared for Constantine. It's just the actual concept of some of the demons, curses etc. as they become apparent. Sense of creeping dread. Page turns aplenty.

    I also read The Filth recently. Not really a horror comic but aspects of it were really frightening (surprisingly enough, for me, this was the more down-to-earth story aspects). The protagonists life is just being systematically ruined in every possible way and it just had that nightmarish quality, like a dream where nobody will believe you. I think it also worked better because it only really revolved around one character so you were forced into sympathizing. Think about the horror movies you watch. There's a difference between a true horror movie and a slasher. Slashers are full of superflous douchebags who you can't wait to go. If you liked them, you wouldn't enjoy the film. Proper horror is more subtle in that the writer, whatever medium, has to make you sympathize with the characters, or the whole thing falls apart.

    That's my two pence anyway.



  4. MartinBrandt Guest

    Quote Originally Posted by Dungbeetle View Post
    Aaaaargh. By "Lore" I meant "Canon".

    The most historically correct version doesn't automatically become the most entertaining, or meaningful, for that matter. Like I said, horror is at its best when it's allegorical. Frankenstein is horror but it's also often viewed as the original science fiction story because it deals with the subject of man playing God. A vampire that is not aristocratic may be more in keeping with folklore, but does it make a good story, or does it just turn the vampire back into a generic monster that could for all intents and purposes be replaced with a goblin, big scary dog or mother in law? The idea of vampires needing to be sired just builds upon this.

    You can take that or leave it. I just think the idea of vampires as metaphor for social parasites preying on the vulnerable can still be flipped a million different original ways if people want to. You obviously don't share my opinion of landlords.
    Sorry, just when someone says Lore vs standard Fiction application I get a bit touchy perhaps. There are too many children in this world (some of them even in their 30s at this point) who don't understand the basis for things. To them Ann Rice and Whitewolf created vampires and werewolves or they based their works "directly" from source legends and myths.

    It is a pet peeve, obliviously you know the whole thing or at least the important parts.

    Though to me old vampiric lore is more than something that could be replaced by just any monster. There are certain qualities to it, so we can just disagree there.

    As for landlords, if you mean the ones who rent you houses, oh they are blood suckers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dungbeetle View Post
    Proper horror is more subtle in that the writer, whatever medium, has to make you sympathize with the characters, or the whole thing falls apart.
    Nail on the head! Without some sympathy for the characters involved it falls flat and will never reach a realm of horror. Well written characters we can become engrossed in is paramount.

    I agree.



  5. AdamH Guest

    There are too many children in this world (some of them even in their 30s at this point) who don't understand the basis for things. To them Ann Rice and Whitewolf created vampires and werewolves or they based their works "directly" from source legends and myths.
    This is a frightening but true statement. Ann Rice and Whitewolf can introduce you to the world of Vampires and Werewolves, but don't claim they created them. If someone tells you Stephanie Meyer created vampires, I think it would be best to stake them in the heart.



  6. MartinBrandt Guest

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamH View Post
    This is a frightening but true statement. Ann Rice and Whitewolf can introduce you to the world of Vampires and Werewolves, but don't claim they created them. If someone tells you Stephanie Meyer created vampires, I think it would be best to stake them in the heart.
    I just punch babies, I find at some point children these days will deserve it anyways. (I kid, I kid.)

    Shiney Emo Vampires... What has this world come to?



  7. Sliverbane Guest

    CoooooOOool

    If someone tells you Stephanie Meyer created vampires, I think it would be best to stake them in the heart.
    YES!!




    Steven:

    I remember, quite a few years ago, where a story arc in Marvel's Bishop comic won an award for horror. (Yes, I know I went way back. It's okay.)

    So, to answer the question, yes, you can 'insert' horror into a story, or even mix genre's. However, I suggest having it be organic to the story. If it's something that just gets tacked on, readers will notice, and you'll throw them right out of the story. However, if it is organic AND they don't see it coming AND it fits...congratulations on good storytelling. Just make sure you have a way out of it. (We'll talk about writing yourself into a corner sometime in the future.)
    I thought as much. I've been trying to capture a certain amount of horror around my main villain - something that sneaks up on the reader and rapes them in the face! (Sorry for the harsh anaolgy, but I heard that line in movie and it fit) :eek:



  8. MartinBrandt Guest

    Quote Originally Posted by Sliverbane View Post



    I thought as much. I've been trying to capture a certain amount of horror around my main villain - something that sneaks up on the reader and rapes them in the face! (Sorry for the harsh anaolgy, but I heard that line in movie and it fit) :eek:

    Rapes you in the face. Silverbane, you are fast becoming my favorite.



  9. BarriLang Guest

    I'm writing a book that has Werewolves and the villains so I'm keeping a close eye on this topic. Steve's got the script for iss 1 for the Proving grounds, his kind review plus the Bolts and Nuts should help.

    I'm going to be heavilly researching Werewolves now to find any interesting and underused characteristics that may crop up... that being said I also want to stray away from the ctotal fantasy aspect... The wolves can change at any time in my story but the their strength lies in the strenth of the moon's gravitational pull. Full Moon = Stronger Wolf. Also I'm steering clear of silver (well as the method of killing them), silver is a further irritation to them. E.G. Lead Bullets "ow", silver Bullets "OOOOWWWW". They're not invincible, massive trauma to their bodies and organs can and will kill them. "Oh, they'll go down... It just takes a bit more than you're used to giving"

    Horror in the comics is a funny one, though I am pleased I "suggested" but haven't shown the 1st killing.

    Not sure if that's off topic but I just wanted to say I'm excited about this topic
    Last edited by BarriLang; Monday, August 03, 2009 at 04:33 PM.



  10. AdamH Guest

    Do your werewolves rape people in the face? What a twist!



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